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RazorsKiss
Yep, that's me.

Registered: Nov 2003
Location:
Posts: 60

quote:
Originally posted by JerkFace
[B]Emmmmmm............I'm not going to drip into a serious religous question:



Why not? Scared of the Bible? Or ashamed to talk about it in public? This is the sandbox, right? Say whatever you want.


quote:

You consider us swine?



In the biblical sense, where swine are "unclean"? Yes.


In the sense referenced in the Bible verse it's taken from? I don't know. Depends on whether I get torn to pieces or not, huh?

Personally? No.

*note - all edits mine.

quote:

Not true, ****head.



quote:

Let no unwholesome word proceed from your mouth, but only such a word as is good for edification according to the need of the moment, so that it will give grace to those who hear. - Eph. 4.29




quote:

Don't tell me what my job is, ****tard.


quote:

"Holiness is the habit of being of one mind with God, according as we find His mind described in Scripture. It is the habit of agreeing in God's judgement, hating what He hates, loving what He loves, and measuring everything in this world by the standard of His Word. He who most entirely agrees with God, he is the most holy man" - J.C. Ryle

"For I am the LORD who brought you up from the land of Egypt to be your God; thus you shall be holy, for I am holy." - Lev. 11:45



Everything a Christian is, springs from the mind of God, and the word of God. If we do otherwise, we are NOT in accordance with our calling as believers. Show me, in the Bible, where we are NOT called to follow the words of God. Show me where we are commanded NOT to tell of Him to others, at every opportunity?


quote:

Please don't let RK turn you off. He's quite clearly one of those nut job Christians.



Why's that? Because "I am not ashamed to declare the Gospel of Jesus Christ - for it is the power of God, to salvation, to everyone who believes"? Or because I follow the disciples, in Acts, who said ""And He ordered us to preach to the people, and solemnly to testify that this is the One who has been appointed by God as Judge of the living and the dead.".

Is that "un Christian"? Is it? Show me where, in the Bible, since that is the handbook of the believer, where I am in error.


quote:

At least not past calling us swine, ey?



quote:

Do not give what is holy to dogs, and do not throw your pearls before swine, or they will trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you to pieces. - Matthew 7:6


I didn't say it- see above. Jesus did. Someone was asking me if this situation was what that applied to. I dunno. I DO know that my opinion is that there should be no area that is free of the aegis of Christianity, in a Christian life.

quote:

And who are you to say?



quote:

Therefore, to one who knows the right thing to do and does not do it, to him it is sin. - James 4:17




(Post #1 - exceeded the character limit, in entirety.)

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Old Post 07-24-2004 09:24 PM
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RazorsKiss
Yep, that's me.

Registered: Nov 2003
Location:
Posts: 60

(Continuation)

quote:

Yes. The good lord has a place for you and DireCoyote, sitting at his right hand, for being a martyr. Naturally, you don't have the b***s to be a real martyr, you just RP one on the internet .



That's speculation. I'm not going to "hold forth" on the purity of my motives. It's not worth the effort to defend that - because firstly, nobody cares, and second, that's nothing but caving to pride - to defend oneself as the "great arbiter of truth" - I've never granted myself such a title, but I DO know my Bible. Do you?



Do you know what God commands Christians to do? If so, why not do it? Why curse? Why directly contradict many of the basic tenets of the Christian faith in a single post, if you stand for what God stands for?



It has nothing to do with my own "judgement" of your theology - it has to do with comparing your statements directly to the Bible. If they don't match, who's wrong? You, or the Bible?



quote:

You're kidding, right?



Are you? In a Christian university? What gives?


quote:

RazorKiss,

I have been attending Catholic institutions for last 18 or so years. A Catholic grade school, a Catholic high school, and a Catholic university. I can tell you, that beyond any reasonable doubt, your understanding of your own purported religion is so remedial, that I can’t even understand how you can even begin to attempt to study it, let alone preach it.



Then to pull a page from Debate 101, prove it. Be a Berean.


quote:

Hell man, I would even venture to guess most ****ing protestants would think twice about jumping down with your watered down, self-serving, 12 step program version of Christianity.



Watered down? How is that. Personally, I'd put a version that alleges that casual cursing is acceptable a lot closer to "watered down" than anything MORE strict than the "version" you're proposing. Here's my "watered down" Christianity. I believe every single word, in every single verse, and every single verse in the entire Bible is literal, absolute, truth. That's about as far as you CAN get from watering it down, bud. I'd like to advance a theory, for the sake of debate. I theorize that you cannot, by use of biblical reference and studies, prove me wrong in my theology. I challenge you to prove me wrong. Not assert, not indicate, not imply - prove. There's a gauntlet. The only measure of a Christian is Christ, and His Word. So use it.

quote:

Now with certainty, you’ve probably got someone calling themselves a study leader who has lead you in a drastically wrong direction. I’m very sorry to hear that there are still more quirky *** little sub-sects who have so brutalized an otherwise functional belief tradition. I strongly urge you to seek some better advice, from a real ordained priest or perhaps even somebody with a more traditional view on the belief.



I'm a relatively main-line Protestant. You're a relatively liberal Catholic, it seems, by the arguments you're making. Just for reference - "wrong" = away from Biblical truth - "right" = closer to Biblical truth. Base your assertions on the Bible, or don't bother arguing theology. Protestantism was a conservative move away from the Catholic/Anglican progression into form above substance. Substance matters. Use the Bible to back up your claims that I'm "wrong".

quote:

You need to figure out your story a little bit better friend. Are you a sheep to the Shepard? Or an apostle? The two don’t mutually exist in any respected version of the Christian tradition. So settle your ****ing dichotomy, and then come back and try to give us a lecture.



Sheep are almost universally portrayed as "followers" of Christ. Shepherds can be either Christ himself, the Father, or pastors, who "shepherd" their "flocks". Use the Bible, or don't bother asserting something with no factual backup whatsoever.

quote:

Jumpgate has higher average IQ then most online communities. I’d venture to guess, that most people would hear your little religious views if you’d at least take the ****ing time to read up on your **** and come to us with a real point of view, not some half witted **** you picked up watching some Sunday morning televangelist show.



Again, prove, since you've taken the "intellectual high ground" that your concept and interpretation of Scripture you're basing this diatribe on is valid, and that your arguments have merit. You're arguing with all bluster, and no backing. Solid, factual, Scripture interpretation, or you're just flapping your opinions in the breeze, with no Biblical refernce to bolster your claim. You DO believe the church is commanded to follow God's word to the letter, correct? If not, I'd be happy to show you where we're told to do so. If you purport to believe in the God of the Bible - PROVE IT. By using the Bible

quote:

I like your “preacher at Mardis Gras” analogy. There’s nothing wrong with taking that position, naturally. But the only thing worse then people who don’t share a particular belief in god, are those that pervert or misspeak that belief either out of their own ignorance or mal intent. – and that is the exact sin you have committed here.



In what way? An entire post about Biblical "mis-interpretation", and I've yet to see a verse from you. Do you have any biblical basis for this, or are you just giving your opinion? There ARE no opinions when it comes to right or wrong - except God's opinion. So, give it to me straight - what, from the Bible am I doing wrong? And support it.

quote:

There are 3 ways to spot a lousy Christian:

- Shrouding themselves with biblical verses. If you actually knew the ****ing religion, you’d be able to get yourself off the wheel chair of chapter:verse.



As a student of the Scriptures, Im sure you know that the Bible is the literal Word of God, right?

Besides, how CAN you argue against this?

quote:

All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof , for correction, for training in righteousness;
so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work. - 2 Timothy 3:16-17



quote:

Worse yet, you used a search query on bible.com or some **** to find verses with a word and then quoted them thinking we’re so ****ing stupid, we wouldn’t notice that the meaning of the verses and the related context was all wrong.



For what? Do you know what the point was? And, please back up your assertion - again.

quote:

- Self-grandeur – I don’t give a **** how well you can quote the bible. It doesn’t prove a ****ing thing to me or anyone else.



Doesn't impress me either. I know what the verses were I wanted, though, cause I've memorized Scripture for years. But the Bible is so much easier to share online - and much faster to share when you have it in front of you in that form. The quoting is not the point - you missed it. It's the content in the verse that matters. You know - the literal Word of God? That thing we're supposed to follow?

quote:

But you seem to believe it makes you somehow important “I’m the preacher at Mardi Gras, now you may ridicule me as a martyr, I’m doing god’s work!!”. **** off. You’ve accomplished nothing. You keep up on this pace, you’re going to remain a mediocre fringe follower and amount to a big fat *** zero.



Important? Not really.

quote:

On the contrary, who are you, O man, who answers back to God? The thing molded will not say to the molder, "Why did you make me like this," will it?



As the hymn says - "He has formed me from the dust - and to dust I shall return".

But, my mission, as is yours, as a Christian, is to "make disciples of all nations" - you know, that "Great Commission" thing. Among others.

quote:

- All words, no action. If you were a true Christian, and you really believed in the concepts you were talking about, you’d do something so that somebody would take you seriously. Till you do that it’s just ****ing words on a computer monitor.



And, mister I only know you across a computer monitor - how do you know what I do, or don't do? You don't. I don't tell everyone what i do for God - "Don't let your right hand know what the left is doing" - remember? Don't assume.

And use something, anything, from the Bible, if you want your claims at Bible scholarship and study taken seriously.

Awaiting your reply,

~ RK


P.S. -
quote:

Now I urge you, brethren, keep your eye on those who cause dissensions and hindrances contrary to the teaching which you learned, and turn away from them. For such men are slaves, not of our Lord Christ but of their own appetites; and by their smooth and flattering speech they deceive the hearts of the unsuspecting. For the report of your obedience has reached to all; therefore I am rejoicing over you, but I want you to be wise in what is good and innocent in what is evil. - Romans 16:17-20



Prove that's not you. Out of the Bible, since that's the ONLY true test - of doctrine, and of Truth. Tell the Truth, with the Truth, or sit your butt down.

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Old Post 07-24-2004 09:30 PM
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Nocturnus
Machine Gunnilinguist.

Registered: Oct 2002
Location: Australia
Posts: 106

Talking

:: pokes RK with a stick ::

That was one hell of a post... ANd I can proudly say that I scrolled over it with a glazed look in my eyes... The same one I get when my Mom quotes the book at me :P

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Old Post 07-24-2004 10:27 PM
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Ceryn
Future Mrs.Caca

Registered: Jul 2004
Location: Pensacola FL
Posts: 65

yeah Id congratulate him but I dot know what he wrote and what he quote. I think MAYBE 1/4 of that was him actually talking.


Hey Jerk...4th way to spot a lousey christian.... You cant read their posts with out a drink and a piss inbetween quotes....ohh look im sterotyping... thats just RK.

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Old Post 07-24-2004 11:31 PM
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RazorsKiss
Yep, that's me.

Registered: Nov 2003
Location:
Posts: 60

How else are you supposed to debate theology?

If you're going to debate theology with someone, use the "sacred text" of the religion, at least

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Old Post 07-24-2004 11:35 PM
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Ceryn
Future Mrs.Caca

Registered: Jul 2004
Location: Pensacola FL
Posts: 65

yes but shouldnt you put it in your own words? Quoting someting over and over agin isnt the best way to debate or talk about anything.. Who talks to a textbook? You should take those quotes and put some feeling into them, not just puke the text. A good teacher takes the text and uses it as a backbone or refence not as a shield.

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Old Post 07-24-2004 11:51 PM
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RazorsKiss
Yep, that's me.

Registered: Nov 2003
Location:
Posts: 60

I do. I take the text to demonstrate the point, then talk about what I'm pointing out.

I've been doing this forum debating thing for a while

But that being said, Jerk used not a single reference or quote to rebut - everything was an opinion. As valuable as those *can* be, when debating theology, you *must* demonstrate at least a working knowledge of the subject matter. In the case of Christianity, a major tenet is that the Bible is the divinely inspired, inerrant word of God Himself.

It's not just a claim "made up by some kooky right-winger" - it says so, right in the Bible!

quote:

All Scripture is inspired by God (1 Timothy 3:16a)



The word, in Greek, is "qeopneustoß", transliterated to "Theopneustos". This word you'll recognize by two things - the first part of the word is "theo" - like "theocracy", or "theist" - it means "God". The second part is "pneo" - to breathe, to blow - the same root word "pneuma" comes from - as in "lungs".

All Scripture (the Bible) is God-breathed! The very breath of God.

I don't know about you, but I don't think many other (if any) "religious texts" make that claim, do you?

That's why I quote the Bible. It's the most well-maintained manuscript in history - contains writing passed down over literally thousands of years, - is internally accurate to a supernatural degree - claims to be, and proves itself to be supernatural in origin - and is the inerrant guidebook and manual for the person who claims to follow the God professed in it.

"How could one book be so important", you ask? What other book has been read more? What other book can be said to have changed the course of history itself to the extent the Bible has? What book has been quoted more by other writers? What book is more full of wisdom? What book has inspired more art, more music, and more literature than the Bible? The answer is - NONE.

Period. Nothing else even comes close. Do a study, and check up on exactly how many legible, intact copies there are of the Old and New Testament there are to verify its accuracy. Check up on the internal consistency. If you find a few things that seem to be errors - think about the time period involved, the cultural shifts we're looking at the "errors" from - and the vast, vast amount of material you're sorting through in the Bible - and that's there's a higher likelihood YOU'RE wrong than that the Bible is wrong - ancient history, cultural studies, just mountains of information. Do a check on the factual "error" ratio of the Bible. It's extraordinary, what you find. It's unbelieveable - in anything but what it claims to be. Nowhere else, in the history of mankind has one volume laid out such a panoramic of independently verifiable history, as the Bible. So much detail that it quotes the geneaology of Jesus - all the way back to ADAM. It's the history of mankind, and it's struggle with moral free will. Not only is it a good story - it's a TRUE story.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
See, there was a whole post with one quote.

Plus, you got to learn a bit about Greek, too

But, I wouldn't trust my veracity on those "facts" without references - would you? So, verify them independently. I'm pretty sure I'm mostly right concerning most of the above. But Im fallible, like everyone else. So, when I speak about moral issues, I trust the one source that's been proven, for thousands of years, as being the Truth, with a capital T.

The Bible.

Make a bit more sense?

~RK

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Old Post 07-25-2004 12:15 AM
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Ceryn
Future Mrs.Caca

Registered: Jul 2004
Location: Pensacola FL
Posts: 65

To me your quoting a text that is based on a fictional character and its all spectulation and opinion to me. Its stories. Yes, it has been read more than other books, its a great story, It holds the "answers" to life and beyond. People looking for answers and tend to grab somethign to hold on to, to help them deal with life and hardships. But Whos answers are they? There are to many religions in this world to pick one. And There were many religions around before Jesus and Christianity.

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Old Post 07-25-2004 12:28 AM
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Injustice
Bringer of Fallout

Registered: Jul 2004
Location:
Posts: 110

You know, RK. You're gonna be really pissed when you die and find out you wasted your time worshipping something that doesn't exist. You can sit there and quote scripture over and over again until your fingers are numb. You can spout opinions about your interpretation of Christianity all you damn well please. We all know where religion comes from realisticly speaking. Our fear of death. But let me ask you a question, for which I seriously doubt you have a legitimate answer, and is the very reason that your "Kingdom of God" bull**** does not amuse me. Have you ever actually seen death? And I'm not talking about watching your poor old Grandmother on the operating table as they pull the plug. I'm talking about having the guy you shared a fighting hole with get shot in the neck, fall back into your arms, and while he's drowning of his own blood, look up at you, and struggle to mouth the word "Help". But you can't help him, all you can do is watch him die. So what would you do RK? Lamant his fate and tell everyone he's in a better place? And what in the **** does that accomplish? I, unlike you, have seen men die, in some of the most horrible ways you can imagine. Some of them came back in pieces no bigger than my thumb, and I can tell you beyond a shadow of a doubt, that when men die, they just die. They cease to live. Nothing more, nothing less. It will always amaze me that Christians, of all people, naturally assume that they're interpretation of "religion" is correct, and everyone else is heathen. Self-righteous, close-minded bastards like you make me want to vomit.

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Old Post 07-25-2004 12:33 AM
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RazorsKiss
Yep, that's me.

Registered: Nov 2003
Location:
Posts: 60

There is no "to me", or "to you" when dealing with truth vs fiction, though.

The question is out there - the Bible claims to be the exact, inspired, and infallible word of God himself. No other book, no other religious text makes that claim. If you deny that claim, you deny the entire point of the Bible!

A book which says "I wrote this - and I created the world, and YOU" - is either patent nonsense, or completely true.

You can't say "oh, this is a good book" - if it's patently INSANE, can you?

It's a book written over 5,000 years, and that purports to be the very words of God himself. If that's not true, it's just gibberish, isn't it?

So don't give me the line "oh, it's a good book, but I don't believe that stuff".

If it's NOT the exact word of God, you have a 5,000 year old string of madmen, stretching all the way back to Egypt, at very least. Moses was the author of the first 5 books of the Bible. So, you either have a string of madmen, for 5,000 years - does that scare anyone? Or, you have the exact, literal word of God himself - which should scare you a lot more, considering what's in it.

So, which is it?

Madmen, Liars or Prophets?

There isn't much wiggle room. Those Jews and Christians who believe this nonsense - this book about a God who does miracles, saves people from sins - isn't that kind of stuff too dangerous to expose your children and yourself to - if it's not what it says it is?

So, don't dance around the issue.

Is the Bible the work of:

A: Thousands of years of Madmen?
B. Thousands of years of Liars (or the deceived)?
C: Thousands of years of Prophets?

You have to put every religion to the test. Are it's tenets internally compatible with themselves, are it's texts rife with errors and inconsistencies, and does it work. Does it change the world.

Nothing, absolutely nothing, has had the effect on the world that Christianity and Judaism has.

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Last edited by RazorsKiss on 07-25-2004 at 12:51 AM

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Old Post 07-25-2004 12:43 AM
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RazorsKiss
Yep, that's me.

Registered: Nov 2003
Location:
Posts: 60

Inj, I'll answer as best as I can tomorrow.

I'm running on quite a few thousand words, just tonight - and I need to, like, be at Church in the morning

So, yeah.

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Raith
Junior Member

Registered: Jul 2004
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Posts: 3

RazorsKiss molests children.

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Old Post 07-25-2004 01:04 AM
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RazorsKiss
Yep, that's me.

Registered: Nov 2003
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Posts: 60

Nope. But thanks for the character study.

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Ignoratio Elenchi - Non Causa, ProCausa - Tu Quoque
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Old Post 07-25-2004 01:07 AM
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Injustice
Bringer of Fallout

Registered: Jul 2004
Location:
Posts: 110

Umm, the answer is A: Thousands of years of Madmen. I know because I got the answer key online. And just out of curiousity, if there really is/was a God, why did it take him damn near 6 billion years to decide to create men in his own image? And if we were created by God in his own image, why do we bear such striking similarities to gorilla's and chimpanzi's? Did God **** up the first two times and figure third times the charm? If it really did rain for 40 days and 40 nights, why is there no evidence of it? And why hasn't God come back to do it again, considering the world is so full of "non-believers" nowadays. The simple fact of the matter is, all throughout the Bible, you read of events that were possible only through the will of divinity. Everything from the parting of the Red Sea, to Christ's resurrection. How come you don't see that anymore? Oh sure, God stuck his nose in when the Hebrew's were being inslaved by the Egyptians "Oh why hath the Lord not heard the cries of his people in bondage?". So I ask you, if God would act in circumstances such as that, WHERE IN THE **** WAS HE WHEN THE JEWS WERE BEING MURDERED BY THE MILLIONS AT AUSCHWITZ? I suggest you take your Bible thumping bull**** and go convince a compound full of hippies to comit suicide.

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Old Post 07-25-2004 01:08 AM
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Ceryn
Future Mrs.Caca

Registered: Jul 2004
Location: Pensacola FL
Posts: 65

quote:
Originally posted by RazorsKiss
There is no "to me", or "to you" when dealing with truth or fiction, though.



ok.. so matter of opinions dont hold up. Everything you say is basicly your opinion, but ok.


quote:
The question is out there - the Bible claims to be the exact, inspired, and infallible word of God himself. No other book, no other religious text makes that claim. If you deny that claim, you deny the entire point of the Bible!


Claims... exactly. I do deny the point of the bible. My choice.

quote:
A book which says "I wrote this - and I created the world, and YOU" - is either patent nonsense, or completely true. You can't say "oh, this is a good book" - if it's patently INSANE, can you?



A book... well I loved Fight Club, and that was a book that was completely insane, but many people called it a great or a good book. Just a thought.


quote:

It's a book written over 5,000 years, and that purports to be the very words of God himself. If that's not true, it's just gibberish, isn't it?

So don't give me the line "oh, it's a good book, but I don't believe that stuff".

If it's NOT the exact word of God, you have a 5,000 year old string of madmen, stretching all the way back to Egypt, at very least. Moses was the author of the first 5 books of the Bible. So, you either have a string of madmen, for 5,000 years - does that scare anyone? Or, you have the exact, literal word of God himself - which should scare you a lot more, considering what's in it.
So, which is it?



So which is it the word of God or the word of god interpeted by others aka Moses? I am sure there was a man named Jesus, Im sure he did many things to make people happy. But I doubt the rest of the story.

You know what scares me? All of the war, death, and torture that has happened over tha last 5,000 years over the interpretation of this book. Christians killing Christians, Christians torturing many many people that refused the word of god. The means of those tortures, the vagina pear.. my personal favorite what sick madman came up with that one? Oh she dosent believe in God.. stick this pointy metal object in her vagina and open it. Oh and women in the bible... that scares me. Women are basically portrayed as evil and somewhat worthless. So yes midevil Christianity scares me. But today we do it in a different manner. Are wars are with other religions still but there more classy, we use guns and nukes. Blast them all to hell. Im not sure which is worse, Its masked today where at least back in the dark ages they said choose Our path or die. I dont see how a religion that has all of this hatred and violence in its past, its beggining can be a good thing.

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Injustice
Bringer of Fallout

Registered: Jul 2004
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God must've had a heart attack and died when the Christians began the first Crusade. "Rape, pillage, and burn, all in the name of Jesus Christ". No wonder the Romans fed them to the lions.

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New Post 07-25-2004 02:16 AM
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JerkFace
Funkiest White Man Ever!

Registered: Jul 2004
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RK,

You've posted so much crap here, that I'm going to take it from the top on down. I’m going to skip over parts which are ramblings and not really ‘points’ of any kind. Again, I strongly urge you to go down the path of academic study of theology. Your half-*** Persian Bazaar thoughts on the matter are childish, at best.

quote:
In the biblical sense, where swine are "unclean"? Yes.

And who may call another unclean? You? Over the internet? You know jack about 90% of the people here, yet you feel from a few lines of text over the internet you may toss around biblical terms? Show how seriously you take your religion.

“Show me, in the Bible, where we are NOT called to follow the words of God. Show me where we are commanded NOT to tell of Him to others, at every opportunity?”

Show me in the bible, where a believer is offered the right/privilege/ability to adjudge another’s views as being unclean. “Let he who has not sinned…” and you know the rest…..I hope.

“Why's that? Because "I am not ashamed to declare the Gospel of Jesus Christ - for it is the power of God, to salvation, to everyone who believes"? Or because I follow the disciples, in Acts,”

Yeah. The propaganda fits in nice here. We realize you’re not ashamed to declare what little you know, what I’m suggesting is that you learn a bit more. By the way, you’re not a ****ing disciple. No variety of the Christian tradition that I know of encourages you to pretend to be one. That is a title reserved for these 12 dudes who were hand picked by the big guy himself. Don’t think that you’re one of them. You’re not. You’re about 2000 years too late to join that club. Especially given the fact that you seem to have a preference for the "flock of sheep" theory.
“I didn't say it- see above. Jesus did.”
Jesus said I’m unclean? Show me that line, please.

“That's speculation.”
Hardly. Quit hiding behind the bull****. “I’m going to post my Christian views, and I want you to make fun of me for it”……..if that’s not a request for crucifixion, I don’t know what is.

“but I DO know my Bible. Do you?”
I dunno, 18 years of academic study, verse your what? Year? 2 years? 5 years of bull**** Protestant Jehova’s Witness swill? YOUR knowledge of the bible is limited to what YOU want to grasp. You take random quotes and string them together to defend a position that you can’t hold your on your own. “look guys, it’s in the bible……I showed it to you”, while otherwise you couldn’t possibly think on your own. Oh wait….I guess the Bible doesn’t tell you to do that, does it?

“Why directly contradict many of the basic tenets of the Christian faith in a single post, if you stand for what God stands for?”
Are you a child? What cursing have I done that has violated what god ‘commands’ of me? What have I done that contradicts anything? I call you on your bull****, which, as far as I’m concerned is doing the lord’s work. I’m sure he doesn’t want wacky *** un-educate running around misquoting him and calling it ‘the word of god’.

“Watered down? How is that.”
How about the fact that you can’t seem to decide whether you’re a sheep or a fisher of men? You can’t be both. It doesn’t work that way.

“Christianity. I believe every single word, in every single verse, and every single verse in the entire Bible is literal, absolute, truth.”
You quote the New American Standard? Do you consider reading the funny pages ‘reading the news paper? LOL. Give me a break. NAS is for pansies and people who don’t know any better. If you were unaware, the NAS is actually a revision of the Revised Standard, a particularly ridiculous version of the bible. The influence is still there, obviously. Ridiculous interpretations breed ridiculous beliefs….

“I challenge you to prove me wrong. Not assert, not indicate, not imply - prove.”
Oh yeah. I’ve never heard that one before. See, anybody with an IQ above….I don’t know….about 10 knows that no matter what I say, you’re going to run and hide behind a few bible passages. It’s a great tactic, used by high school freshman to deal with particularly challenging teachers. Allow me to offer a counter challenge: I DARE you to step off the bible for a moment and try to play with the big kids. Lets see how your philosophy holds up when you come off the shore for a bit. Want to prove yourself? Face the sharks, we’ll see what you have. My bet is that you won’t do it. And you won’t do it, because even you realize how inept you are when you’re not playing talking heads.

“I'm a relatively main-line Protestant.”
Main-Line protestant? LOL. What?

“Base your assertions on the Bible, or don't bother arguing theology.”
Such a child. How pathetic. “Quote the bible or don’t argue”. Guess what: Conceptually you’re correct. The bible is a blue print for living in faith. It is not the philosophical end-all, and it’s sure as **** not all you need to pass the grand test. I can read the jumpgate manual and still suck at it. It takes a great deal of practice and of understanding of concepts to truly grasp the ideas contained within. Likewise, so does the path you’ve chosen. Don’t believe for a second that you’re anywhere NEAR where you need to be to pull the trick off right.

“Protestantism was a conservative move away from the Catholic/Anglican progression into form above substance.”
You’re really that far off, aren’t you? Normally, I’d laugh when something like this has been said. But my guess is that you Really and truly believe that’s how it is. I’ll put it simple for you: It’s kind of like how the republicans used to be more liberal then democrats way back in the 1800’s. It no longer applies today.

“Sheep are almost universally portrayed as "followers" of Christ. Shepherds can be either Christ himself, the Father, or pastors, who "shepherd" their "flocks".”
And which are you?

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New Post 07-25-2004 02:27 AM
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JerkFace
Funkiest White Man Ever!

Registered: Jul 2004
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And in summation…….

You have a profound inability to not respect those that know more then you. It’s quite sad really. The true Christian understands that there are those whom you can learn from, and those are people with experience, expertise, or study that is beyond that of your own. The true Christian understands that there is no “black belt in Jesus”. Belief is a process and a series of evolutions, self-learning, and epiphanies that one goes through. It involves all manners of challenge, be it from outside sources or from ones own self. YOU HAVE NONE, OF THESE. Naturally, you’re going to look it up in your Modern English Bible, or whatever other coloring book version you’ve been reading and not find that, so you’re not going to believe it. Thus you’re going to permanently remain in the barely learned state, left to wallow in your lack of beliefs.
Uh oh--------There’s some common sense. You’d better run to your CBSB (coloring book standard bible) and find some passage to counter that idea!!! Holy ****!!! The ship is going down!!
The true Christian understands that the what the bible is, and what it is to be used for. You don’t read it and get a free key to the pearly gates. There’s no secret code, there’s no secret messages, and it’s not intended to be used as a ‘book of cool quotes’ for the barely literate to string together a hand full of passages to prove a point. Want me to do that? Sure----here we go:

Gen 1:11: And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so.

Gen 1:12: And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good.

Ex 9:25 And the hail smote throughout all the land of Egypt all that was in the field, both man and beast; and the hail smote every herb of the field,

Well lookee what we learned there. Everybody knows that ‘herb’ is another word for pot (ya know, marijuana, cannabis). Right there, the bible says that got gave us herb. God gave us pot and intends us to use it? Cool. Potheads unite!!! It’s time that we smoke some reefer in the name of the lord!!!

Guess what? I can do that all day long. And whatever counter argument you provide, I can respond with “Well, I’m a literal interpreter, so unless you can find me a passage in the bible where it says pot is wrong, I’ll take it that God supports it!!”

Want a real bible quote? Fine.

“12 And whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted. 13 But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in. 14 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation. 15 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves. 16 Woe unto you, ye blind guides, which say, Whosoever shall swear by the temple, it is nothing; but whosoever shall swear by the gold of the temple, he is a debtor! 17 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gold, or the temple that sanctifieth the gold? 18 And, Whosoever shall swear by the altar, it is nothing; but whosoever sweareth by the gift that is upon it, he is guilty. 19 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gift, or the altar that sanctifieth the gift? 20 Whoso therefore shall swear by the altar, sweareth by it, and by all things thereon. 21 And whoso shall swear by the temple, sweareth by it, and by him that dwelleth therein. 22 And he that shall swear by heaven, sweareth by the throne of God, and by him that sitteth thereon. 23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone. 24 Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel. 25 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye make clean the outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of extortion and excess. 26”

Oh I’m sorry. That might be a little bit tough for you to read because it’s not a 10 line verse in New Standard. Yeah that’s right……it provides context. So I’ll blurb it down for you, I leave “And whosoever shall swear by the altar, it is nothing, but whoever sweareth by the gift that is upon it, he is guilty.” I’m quite certain that the meaning of this will be lost on you. Swearing by the altar and swearing by the gift…….what are we talking about here? Gee whiz, swearing by the altar is nothing…..could we be talking about somebody who mindlessly spews bible verse? Swearing by the gift? Hmm-----well on that analogy, I guess we’d be talking about one who does the above mentioned in hopes of some form of self-gratification. Hmmm…..still want to play the bible doth quoteth game with me? I can do more and work with the idea of the “blind” if you like.

I’ll throw another one at you. This one isn’t from the bible, it’s from a theologian. You know…….one who studies the bible to understand it? A man named Pius, (not Pope Pius) wrote a little thing in Latin, the title of which translates out to “On Truth In God”. Pius writes, “One must understand the way of Christ before one teaches the way of Christ, for the shadows of the bound provide only shade for the meager”.
You may have lost that one too. I’ll explain it. You see, Razor, I have no doubt that your heart is in the right place. But this wacky *** coloring book version of God that you’re trying to make your point with really comes off as an artless con. Now, I certainly believe that this is because someone tried (and succeeded) in using the artless con on you. The Path of God is much like the Path of Rho: it is not an easy one. You’re starting off well, but your intensity would be far better put towards furthering your own understanding and evolving past the point where you look up bible passages that suit your need, string a few together in a self-serving manner, and then use it to attempt to prove a point. I can do it back and forth all day, as it is perhaps the most remedial method of debating theology.